The Sexy Senate Seduction of S.B.5: An introduction to collective bargaining reform in Ohio

What’s better than sex?  I’m talking about the kind of sex that people fantasize about in their deepest darkest secrets. It’s Senate Bill 5 otherwise known as SB5

Oh yes, SB5 is one of the most exotic, sexy pieces of legislation ever to grace paper and to come from the lips of a State Senator Shannon Jones. The dialogue and beauty of the text is enough to turn the coldest heart into a lavish, promiscuous, insidious romantic.

So what is this salacious document that I’m speaking so highly of? It’s the first, most aggressive legislation since the infamous 1983 act in favor of collective bargaining implementation, to be enacted in an attempt to stop the bleeding that public employees represented by unions are imposing on tax payers. For more than 27 years this law has remained unchanged and has strangled the State of Ohio in being able to create a positive business atmosphere that will attract business and bring jobs to Ohio. The organizations that stand behind the collective bargaining law of 1983 have little understanding of business and have over those 27 years helped create a complex puzzle that is straining the states pension system and a host of other labor related issues.

This bill is proposed by Senator Shannon Jones of Clearcreek Twp of the 7th District has the direct support of Governor Kasich and will take a major step in the direction of solving that puzzle by taking off the shackles that are draining the tax revenue flowing to the state from the caretakers of Ohio, the tax payers.

Listen to this guy. He’s why we need SB5. It’s people like him that go to those collective bargining rallies.

Among the many items in the bill the primary reforms are:

• Eliminates collective bargaining for state employees and employees of higher education institutions
• Existing collective bargaining agreements (CBAs) covering those employees expire according to their terms
• Eliminates salary schedules and step increases and replaces them with a merit pay system
• Eliminates continuing contracts for teachers after the bill’s effective date
• Eliminates teacher leave policies in statute and requires local school boards to determine leave time
• Eliminates seniority as a sole criterion for Reductions In Force (RIFs)
• Removes healthcare from bargaining and instead permits school boards to govern healthcare benefit plans for employees
• Requires employees to pay at least 20% of their healthcare costs
• Allows public employers to hire permanent replacement workers during a strike
• Limits bargaining for local government employees (including school districts) to issues of wages, hours and terms and conditions of employment
• Eliminates binding arbitration for police and fire
• Abolishes the School Employee Healthcare Board
• Prohibits school districts from picking up any portion of the employee’s contribution to the pension system
• Allows a public employer in “fiscal emergency” to serve notice to terminate, modify or negotiate a CBA
While much of this bill will focus on the state, it will immediately bring transparency to localities. No longer will local school boards be able to blame the state for policies created and imposed on the districts. Step increases by teachers will now be considered raises, as they should be and school boards will be given much more independence on solving their own problems. Immediately SB5 will make changes to teacher’s contracts and benefits:
• S.B.5 eliminates new continuing, contracts after the bill’s effective date.
• The bill eliminates teacher leave polices from statute and instead requires local boards of education to establish general leave policies for employees who are not covered by a CBA.
• The bill abolishes the School Employee Health Care board and instead permits boards of education to govern health care benefits for employees.

For all these reasons and more SB5 is a bold bill that has the kind of power to seduce business back to Ohio and once again make attractive enterprise not only in bringing jobs back to the state, but to reduce the impact of the syndicate style unions that feed directly off tax payer funds, particularly in education, and allows the money to go where it’s needed. Such a step has been needed for many years but lacked legislators and a governor with the kind of courage needed to implement it.

But like any great romance, there is always a jealous lover, the overly dependent jealous spouse that lives like a leech off the life it professes to love. Below is the press release from just such a jealous, over imposing leech of the state, the OEA. They quickly seek support from their members to attempt to strong arm the bold legislative movement occurring in Columbus. Read for yourself their words and bullet points below.

OHIO EDUCATION ASSOCIATION OPPOSES SENATE BILL FIVE

For Immediate Release
Contact: Michele Prater
614-227-3071; cell 614-378-0469
Ohio Education Association opposes Senate Bill Five
Legislation will weaken public service to Ohio’s children
February 9, 2011
(Columbus) – The Ohio Education Association (OEA) is gravely concerned that the Ohio Senate is not making Ohio’s children a priority. In a tough economy and facing a major budget deficit, Ohio must focus on the essentials, and nothing is more essential than giving our children a quality education that prepares them for good jobs.
Sen. Shannon Jones’ legislation, Senate Bill 5 (SB 5), proposes to drastically curtail collective bargaining rights, ban public employee strikes, end collectively bargained salary schedules for public employees. SB 5 targets all state workers and all Ohio higher education employees, including OEA members at Columbus State, Youngstown State and other public colleges and community colleges, as well as OEA’s State Council of Professional Educators (SCOPE) bargaining unit whose members educate incarcerated adults and youths.
OEA believes collective bargaining helps educators pursue the classroom conditions, tools and support that contribute to the kind of high quality 21st century education essential to preparing students for jobs and successful careers.
Collective bargaining is a problem solving tool that shapes working conditions and improves learning conditions. Since 1983, Ohio’s collective bargaining law has created a framework that has made strikes rare and short in duration. OEA affiliates negotiate effectively to avoid strikes and disruption for student learning.
Senate Bill 5 serves to weaken Ohio’s entire middle class. Rather than creating jobs in Ohio, this legislation will hurt local communities stifling job growth.

OEA’s asks you to remember that:
• Collective bargaining allows educators a voice in improving opportunities for Ohio’s students, better classroom resources and improved teaching and learning conditions
• Teachers know best what’s needed to improve student learning , and collective bargaining gives them the opportunity to focus on teaching rather than time consuming employment issues
• Educators, like all public employees, are an integral part of the fabric of Ohio’s communities. Senate Bill 5 weakens Ohio. Rather than creating jobs, this legislation will hurt local communities, reversing Ohio’s positive economic outlook
• Ohio’s collective bargaining law has created a framework for problem-solving that has made strikes rare. OEA affiliates negotiate effectively to avoid disruption for student learning
• In a tough economy, with Ohio facing a major budget deficit, we must focus on the essentials. Nothing is more essential than giving our children a quality education that prepares them for good jobs.

I have heard in the course of my involvement in education reform virtually every one of those bullet points provided above. They use words like “weaken” and “children” and “hurt” as an attempt to stir up the thoughtless escapades of their followers who will repeat those same lines to the papers and other news organizations. However, the architects of those words have zero experience in creating jobs and creating prosperity. All they have experience in is feeding off society and convincing them that their services are so central to the jobs they are employed by that their reality can’t see the truth. But they have to believe it before they can convince taxpayers how important they are. What they don’t understand is that the regulations they have brought to the State of Ohio have only increased in the last 27 years and the monster they’ve created shows no sign of getting smaller. Under the path of collective bargaining, that monster will require more and more tax money until the system will collapse under the weight of their impositions.

There isn’t a successful formula for collective bargaining in the entire world that has sustained itself over time. The attempts tried have everywhere proved dismal failures, and under SB5 our state government has taken the first bold step to get the state healthy again. The rhetoric of the shallow rooted, selfish protectionists of the status quo will continue to rant the statements similar to the OEA Press Release. But none of them have a real plan. They are scrambling instead to find a way to keep the ponzi schemes going just a little longer because the tragedy for them is that they built their whole lives around those ponzi schemes, and it’s evident now that they won’t get out of the scheme what they invested.

For the rest of us, that chose to work outside that insidious system, and work for ourselves, or companies not tied to collective bargaining, our investment in long term longevity over short term gain proved the wise path. And it is our strategy that must be passed on to the rest of the state for the state’s health and future fortune.

Like all good love-making, sex is best when not rooted in selfish aims, but the mutual benefit of both partners. And the good lover knows what their partner needs even if the partner is obscure to the fact. So the sex is best when not done for the benefit of the giver, but for the receiver.

And that’s why this bill is so sexy. It’s what’s needed even when all parties aren’t aware that they need it. When the bill SB5 is thrust forward into the canvas of Ohio History much to the dismay of the intended object, the real impact will be felt only when selfishness flees the proceedings and both parties work together for mutual bliss.

They’ll thank you later………………..

But as many of you reading this know, sex is not good when third parties are involved and act as agents and matchmakers. That has been the role of collective bargaining in the State of Ohio. And that’s why we need to bypass the matchmakers and head straight for the bed.

Rich Hoffman
http://twitter.com/#!/overmanwarrior
www.overmanwarrior.com

70 thoughts on “The Sexy Senate Seduction of S.B.5: An introduction to collective bargaining reform in Ohio

  1. Sexy? Really?

    How is it “sexy” to give the state that has ignored a decades-old supreme court ruling that declared its school funding system unconstitutional even more power to welch on its contractual obligations?

    Sure it’s fun to beat up on teachers – a lot of us are “dedicated” enough to bend over, take it, and thank you for the experience. But you are going to run out of martyrs real quick if this passes, and then who will be left to educate the children? Only the people dumb enough to take on the daily personal risk of public education without any protections or even a decent paycheck.

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    1. Great comment. Don’t kid yourself. Teachers offer a service that parents are willing to pay for, up to a point. Those contracts were not self regulated and greed took over. So costs have to be brought back in line. We wouldn’t have to do this if your union had maintained some business sense. Communities cannot keep raising taxes to pay for the services you “want” to provide. And who will educate the children? Parents first, teachers second. That is the way it HAS to be! Anything more than that and the teacher has crossed the line. Just because that’s the way its been does not mean that’s the way it should be or will be. And when you say that parents don’t do a good job, that’s in part due to the “increased” role of public education which allowed parents to drop off their kids and let a teacher do their work. Society can no longer fund that level of service. It costs the tax payer and the children.

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      1. That is bull. SB5 destroys public education. You say that “parents are willing to pay for, up to a point. Bull crap!!! 1/2 the kids we have come from broken homes… free and reduced lunch is up a large percentage in the past decade. Teachers are not paid as much as you think. They use the word “educators” so they can throw in administrators… that is not right. It is people like the GOP that put Ohio and the nation into this economic slump. Now you think you can get us out? No way. This is not going save any tax payers one dime. They are not going lower your taxes because SB5 passes. No they will have to raise them. Dedicated, career teachers will be leaving. With what they want to do it will put 300,000 educators at risk of losing their home (less pay) and countless other public employees will be in the same boat.

        I tell you what… you say society does not want to pay for this level of service. Don’t and see what happens. It is society that asks teachers not only to teach, but be parents for their kids, babysit, police children’s actions, and so on and so on and so on. Step up and help your teachers, not hinder them by handcuffing their hands.

        We are the soldiers that fight for tomorrow in this country. We are the ones that fight day in and day out to make sure that ALL students get a good education.

        Do you realize that when you compare students in the US and those around the world that you always discount our children. We put ALL students in this pool. ALL… special needs, ESL, ALL children. Those not college bound and those that are… Did you hear me? ALL our students. Countries like China, only put in their top 10%. Most kids in these countries do not even go to school. They get kicked out of the have emotional issues, are special needs, and are ESL. Only a portion make it to high school and only those that are going be placed in college scores are used. How is that fair?

        Get over yourself…

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      2. Good points from your point of view. I agree with you that parents have become lazy and have asked teachers to do too much. You’re right about that. But you are not right about the justification of proceeding down that path as we have. It’s too expensive and is a failed social experiment. And Teachers will learn to get their costs in line with the rest of society. It’s hard for you to see because you’re in the system. You’ll be suprised how well everyone adjusts. But I’ll tell you what. I don’t want to pay a teacher that spends some of that money on union dues that go to politics I don’t support. That should be illegal. I won’t be happy till it is. Teachers have right to form unions, so long as they aren’t taking public money. No tax money should go to union activity of any kind.

        What you will find is when parents cant pawn off their kids to a teacher to do their jobs, they’ll step it up. Trust me. I’ve managed people for a long time, and people behave in similar patterns. There will still be dead beats, but there are now. Teachers like to believe they are saving those children, but in reality, they don’t, and can’t. Without good parents, those children are damaged in many other ways that no teacher or school system can touch.

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      3. What is a fair wage for a teacher? What are teachers making? I guarantee that you can hazard a guess for the first question but have no idea what the answer to the second question is. Go ahead, Google it, I won’t judge you. It’s probably pretty close to what you thought and probably should be more. You don’t give enough credit to the people that deal with your brats for 9 months out of the year.

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    2. And, where exactly does our “education system” rank compared to others around the globe??? If our education system was ran like a company we would be “out of business” due to where are children rank compared w/others around the globe. Our education system is producing a inferior product (which is our children!!!). In the real world companies producing inferior products do not survive 27 years!!! Welcome to the real world.

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      1. EDUCATE YOURSELF!

        Do you realize that when you compare students in the US and those around the world that you always discount our children. We put ALL students in this pool. ALL… special needs, ESL, ALL children. Those not college bound and those that are… Did you hear me? ALL our students. Countries like China, only put in their top 10%. Most kids in these countries do not even go to school. They get kicked out of the have emotional issues, are special needs, and are ESL. Only a portion make it to high school and only those that are going be placed in college scores are used. How is that fair?

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  2. Is the problem really collective bargaining or wimpy government negotiators giving away the bank?
    Whenever you have a large number of employees some standards are in order. The basis of “merit” can get pretty cloudy & is prone to corruption.
    A better policy would be more hard nosed bargaining by the government.

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  3. I have a question I would love to get an answer for from anyone in the know!!! Was ‘tax dollars’ used for the campaign that happened in Chillicothe, OH at the Comfort Inn which I have posted below???

    WE MUST FIGHT SENATE BILL 5
    ***OCSEA*** We are conducting a phone bank! We need you to participate. This Sunday from 12pm-4pm at the Comfort Inn (Chillicothe) in the meeting room. We will be contacting fellow members

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    1. I have a question I would love to get an answer for from anyone in the know!!! Was ‘tax dollars’ used for the campaign that happened in Chillicothe, OH at the Comfort Inn which I have posted below???

      WE MUST FIGHT SENATE BILL 5
      ***OCSEA*** We are conducting a phone bank! We need you to participate. This Sunday from 12pm-4pm at the Comfort Inn (Chillicothe) in the meeting room. We will be contacting fellow members . . .

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  4. This was posted in regards to one of my comments on a friends Facebook wall. Is this true??? Please explain what is below:

    Michele wrote: “SB 5 may cause layoffs because it will allow DRC to contract for private operation-(section 9.06of SB5), which means this could effect all DRC employees not just union members jobs because it allows DRC to contract for private operation and management.”

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    1. The quick answer is probably. The work will be done by somebody, what this bill will do is take away the monopoloy status which is driving up costs. Some will proclaim this to be unfair, but what it does is bring competition to the situation, which if you have a monopoly that’s not to your advantage. But it is good for the tax payer.

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      1. Fools! The ORC already allows for any corrections institute in the state of Ohio to contract out to private companies. They did it already in Youngstown. You know what they figured out? They figured out that their private sector employees weren’t willing to do anything that might put them in harm’s way because they were making pennies. What happened? After two years of people escaping and people being constantly shanked, the state went back to public ORGANIZED labor in that prison. Want to know why? Because those employees knew what they had to do to keep order in a prison and they were willing to do it. Want to know why these union employees were willing to do it? Because they had previously negotiated the terms and conditions that needed to be present, AND the pay that was necessary for them to do their jobs. When was the last time YOU wanted to be in a cell block with a bunch of convicted felons? These people take pride in their work and they want to be compensated for it. What is wrong with that? Somebody tell me what is wrong with that!

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  5. My friends on Facebook (employees of the prisons in Chillicothe, OH)claim NONE of their union dues are put towards a political agenda!!! Anyone care to respond? Please do!!!

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  6. My friends on Facebook (employees of the prisons in Chillicothe, OH)claim NONE of their union dues are put towards a political agenda!!! Anyone care to respond? Please do!!!

    She wrote;

    Hi David,
    Christina Everidge Minney commented on her status.
    Christina wrote: “Dave, your so wrong! Do a little more research before posting what you think are facts. NONE (Not one $1) of union dues are used for political support…I’m off to work so will get back to this later.”

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  7. Any answers for the following?

    I have a question I would love to get an answer for from anyone in the know!!! Was ‘tax dollars’ used for the campaign that happened in Chillicothe, OH at the Comfort Inn which I have posted below???

    WE MUST FIGHT SENATE BILL 5 ***OCSEA*** We are conducting a phone bank! We need you to […]

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  8. I see that you have taken the easy way out by displaying a passionate, bus driver as your flagship for opposing this bill. Why not the head of the oapff, or the fop, or the teacher’s union? Maybe because they would submit the cold, hard facts. Maybe because they would show the real argument for why this bill is wrong. But no, you want to display the face of public employment as some half-wit.
    I hope you feel good about attacking this issue at the knees. Choosing a dirty way to support a crooked issue. Here I thought the tea party was ankle bighting but now I stumble onto your site.
    I will still take the high ground in telling you what I really think of you but I will tell you that you are the lowest of the low in political activism.
    Make sure you advertise your website at the statehouse on tuesday and thursday so that I can make a point to meet you face to face and have a real talk with you.
    I serve a greater good than you have ever known. Enjoy your emergency services sonny, we have been and always will be there for you.
    Lane

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    1. The Unions are the only one’s putting the sad faces of their members on this issue!!! We seem to be the one’s stating the fact that this ‘system’ is bankrupting the state.

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  9. I find your lies and destructive intent astounding. You display the outright greed and despicable corporate defender attitude that would make Boss Tweed very proud.
    As a greed-first capitalist you are more than willing to complain that we aren’t sucking the Big Business teat enough…MORE for big business! More MORE!
    Oh, but teachers, those greedy bloodsuckers, THEY are ripping us off, robbing taxpayers blind. Right.
    You are a sick disgusting (several extremely descriptive expletives deleted) who can’t wait to turn Ohio into a wasteland of stupid kids ripe for mindless thankless benefitless jobs that your beloved Big Business is more than happy to provide, especially when you wipe out the minimum wage (damned greedy poverty-level unskilled workers!), sick leave, and as much of the rights and benefits that workers have fought and died for over the history of this great nation as you can. You and your fellow Greed Over People party pals are well on your way.
    What you advocate is nothing less than a return to sweatshops, eighty-hour workweeks, and non-existent disability or unemployment protection. You’ll do it with a thousand tiny cuts, and in the end the state of Ohio will indeed bleed. It will hemorrhage skilled educators and teachers, administrators and children in search of reasonable compensation or education beyond that needed to operate a drive-thru headset. Soon enough no one will have to worry about school levies in Ohio, because there won’t be a decent school or educator in the entire state to see it voted down.
    I find it hysterical in a profoundly sad way that you think our (state’s) treatment of business outrageous (how can we get business if we don’t allow them to rape our state without lubrication for obscene profit?) but you think teachers should work for the sheer love of it, and the $10 a week you want to pay them. Idiot.
    You had better pray I never attain any level of public office, because you, Sir, are a traitor to this nation, a servant of corporate interests at the expense of our education, our health, and in fact our very survival. You would be lucky to escape being shot into the Sun on a fast rocket for your attempts to make our next generation sick, fat, stupid, and rightless.
    You and your treasonous ilk will destroy any landscape, enslave any people, allow American citizens to die and go bankrupt and lose their house and see their entire life’s work utterly destroyed to pay your corporate masters enough filthy profit to build a solid gold garage next to their solid gold house to hold their solid gold Hummer.
    This was not the “liberty” our founders had in mind, the ‘liberty’ to strip American citizens of basic human rights and turn this nation into a desperate, servile and defenseless labor pool much like the one China boasts. You deserve nothing less than to be stripped of your citizenship and deported forthwith for your efforts to undermine the people of the United States.
    F*** Y**.

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    1. Great comment! You just made all my points about how foolish and what a waste of money supporting public unions is. You are evidence that public education has failed because you are all over the map confused. Man, you are a complete fool.

      And you try sometime to shoot me, Punk! I’ll send you further away than the sun since you want to make threats from the security of your army of fools! And you can bet I’ll keep that note for future use……boy!

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  10. 1. Into the Sun…shoot you INTO THE SUN. I know you Righties are always fantasizing about OK Corral-style shootouts where you whip out your Glock and calmly empty a 30 round magazine into a crowd of people in order to subdue a purse-snatcher, but it ain’t that kind of party…
    2. I am not your ‘boy’. ‘Punk’, I’ll accept. But nice to see you keepin’ the Old South alive. Got a Stars and Bars sticker on your truck, I’ll wager.
    3. Only insecure bloggers comment on their own story.
    4. Your unsupported allegations that public education is a failure based on me being “all over the map confused” is backwards…it’s not my fault that you are too stupid to follow my writing, and you’re the one who should be complaining about your own inadequate education.

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    1. You need to read a lot more of what I’ve put up then in response to #4. And I follow you quite well. I’ll pick it apart point for point. Tune back in. Because your letter is great stuff.

      Your stereotypes are comical, and show a lot about you. You’d lose the bet. And I comment when attacked.

      Most everything you said is unsupported based on your view of the world. So you opened that door.

      And you lefties are so blind you can’t see beyond your own needs. A selfish lot that pretends that its all about the greater good, but it’s only what you can get from the herd for your own small life.

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  11. As a former public school teacher who refused to join the unions and a current local gov’t employee who is not in a union, I support this wholeheartedly! My laundry list of government waste is long.

    The unions have done a fine job of brainwashing people over the years into believing they cannot work without the union…that they will not be treated fairly. (True back when they started, but not now.)

    Ironically, the unions are the ones creating most of the problems in unionized jobs–slackers, employees/teachers you can’t get rid of even though their work performance stinks, raises that aren’t based on work ethics or performance, inability to increase someone’s wages based on performance, thereby creating a competitive job market.

    Privatize it all, baby. Then employees who actually work hard will be rewarded with good pay and benefits. Choose your employers wisely, too.

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  12. Overdoodle, can you tell me how much money this is going to save the state?? It’s not about saving money, it’s about retribution. And you Darnett your full of shit.

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    1. Who’s overdoodle? You need glasses, dude. It’ll save the state money by not continuing to increase the budget, because without some action, the costs will continue to increase without revenue to match. And the only way revenue can match is to raise taxes and that’s not going to happen. You’re silly idea about this being retribution is childish and short-sighted. The people of the state elected Kasich and other “republicans” to do enact these types of policies. Has nothing to do with political retribution. Kasich might personally feel a little of that because of the way unions came after him, but he was elected to do what he’s doing. He works for me and the rest of the people that elected him.

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  13. What I read above is an example of how politics always pulls the wool over all eyes. If you are stupid enough to believe that paying employees would cause all the finicial problems in Ohio, you truly are an idiot. Lets try this, we pay taxes something a lot of Ohioins do not do. We buy things with what we earn which contibutes to the economy. We are educated law abiding citizens who are professionals. We vote, volunteer, raise our kids and love our communities. All we want is the ability to pay for the American dream. Who do you want to live next to, a cop, fireman, teacher or the local gang banger innercity thug who we do our best to keep you from having to deal with yourself. This SB 5 bill is all politics and nothing else. Kill this bill and work on the real problems.

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    1. Ok, I see what I’m dealing with. You must be the son of one of those collective bargaining supporters. So make sure to explain this to your daddy. Nobody says we’re not going to pay employees. The question is how much is too much, and when tax money taken in cannot pay what’s going out, you’ve reached too much. Yet people like your dad don’t understand limits. And they don’t understand where the money comes from, obviously. I like cops, teachers, and firman so long as they don’t ask for 60K or more and want tens of thousands of such people all on the tax payer dollars. There has to be limits which nobody wants to discuss. Tell your dad to live within a budget and everyone will get along fine. Ask for too much, and we’ll have to create laws like SB5 to shield the tax payer from union greed that didn’t regulate itself.

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  14. This bill will not pass first of all. Second to make this a tea party platform is absolutely garbage. Every problem in this country is due to government and the corruption that accompanies it. Now u want to add “merit” to the machine. How many teachers are there compared to administrators. How many are married to administrators. You talk about bringing jobs to the state but the state is liable to cut 10%-13% of jobs for public employees. How many ppl work for ohio? This passage is a blaspheming piece of garbage. Don’t be a hypocritical liar.

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    1. I don’t lie. And I’m certainly not a hypocrit. You bring up some good points, but you are looking at the situation pressed right up against your nose, and not able to see the larger picture. Maybe that’s not your fault, you may just be a product of the system. But this bill will pass. And it is a Tea Party Platform. I’m not making it anything. If not for the Tea Party, these types of moves wouldn’t happen. That’s why unions have been trying to belittle the Tea Party all this time. Because its the beginning of the end of union monopoly rule. A rule we can no longer afford. Sorry.

      If you manage to scare away 5 or 6 senators, which is your goal, we’ll remove them and put up new, bolder senators that will pass legislation like this. Sooner or later, you better start changing your thinking.

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  15. Are the corrections employees raises or “step increases” been frozen in Ohio? Christina (who works at one of the prisons in Chillicothe, OH) claims they have been. See below;
    Christina wrote:
    “Dave just so you know step increases have been frozen for a while now. I’m sure your salary adjust based on the teamster’s salary so what is your problem…”

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  16. All these issues are not going to be hashed out in the blogosphere but the one thing that must be agreed upon is that Municiple, State and Federal governments are BROKE. If anyone on either side wants a place at the discussion table, they must acknowledge this simple fact.

    At this point, I don’t care what your politcal ideologies are or if you’re pro-union or anti-union. SB5 is about reigning in spending.

    With that being said, public employee funds are one of the two largest pieces of Ohio’s expenditures. No one is getting enjoyment from making cuts, in fact it may be political suicide, but it can’t be ignored.

    I can sympathize with public workers to some degree. No one wants to pay more out of pocket for anything but that does not exempt us from facing the realities of the unsustainable course we are on. Despite what the union mantra says, every study from BLS and other reputable sources indicate public compensation packages on average ARE higher than private sector positions. Salaries are not that far apart but benefits are typically far superior and are guaranteed. Yes, there are a small percentage of CEO-types making 7 figures but are we really saying that if most public employees were not in their current positions, that they would be leading fortune 500 companies?

    And can we get away from the base accusations that Governor Kasich and Senator Jones are doing this to be vindictive against unions? I am personally aware that both are considering private security for their families because of potential threats. Why would anyone endanger their family to be petty?

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  17. I spent about 2 hours looking over the bill this morning. I think I’m even more confuse now. First of all, I worked for two Fortune 50 companies for about 8 years. The pay was good, benefits were good, but I always felt the need to work in a public service. For years people had been telling me I should be a teacher because of my respect for education and my overwhelming passion to make this country an even better place to live once I had kids. I decided to go back to school to become a teacher. While going to school, I got a night job as a facility service associate (maintenance). I was making about $12/hr. Now, I knew I wasn’t going to make as much money as I once did when I became a teacher (I was making $40k/yr and had a company vehicle when I left that job to become a teacher), but I felt that teaching was much more important to our society than what I was doing at the time, and I knew I could live a respectable lifestyle on a teacher’s salary. I must say I have never been a union member, and historically speaking, I’m not a big fan of unions. I believe in earning what you make based off of your performance. That’s how my other jobs were, and that system works. However, I’m concerned about what all of this means for teachers besides eliminating collective bargaining. I have one year of school left before I becomed licensed to teach. For all of us education students out here, what exactly does this mean for us? How will this affect starting salaries? I saw a salary schedule listed within the bill that started teachers with bachelor’s degrees at $20k. I was making more than that as a maintenance man. That doesn’t exactly make sense. I get the whole health care thing, and I don’t have a problem putting my own money into my own retirement funds, but for me and any other teacher to do this salaries have to stay respectable and fit the job. Will they?

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    1. Great comment. The saleries will be able to be maintained by local school boards. So to use the example of Southern Ohio if schools like Mason, or Lakota want to pay starting teachers 35 or 45K that will be up to the district. If the school board paints themselves into a corner by going over budget however, the community can take action, elect new board members, and get costs under control. The way it is now, with a “schedule” it takes everyone and moves them along regardless of merit, or economic conditions. While that is an attractive protection for teachers, it is detrimental to a district trying to control its costs. The salery schedule as listed in the bill is an example, and not the letter of law that all districts must follow.

      What this means for you is that if you want to be a teacher, and come to a district that is excellent, like the schools mentioned, you can still be paid well. Our average down here is 62K a year. But we can’t afford to pay everyone that amount of money. Some teachers are better than others of course, so not everyone will be able to make 62K. But the option is there when skilled professionals that prove themselves invaluable to the district can command extremely good wages as is the case with most everyone in the private sector. Basically, the only workers that have something to worry about with S.B.5 are those that wish to “game” the system and get paid a lot for doing as little as possible. Those types of workers enjoy getting the pay of the best of the best, while performing at average, or below average standards. Sounds like by the way you wrote that comment you’re the kind of person I’d want to hire. I think you’d become more successful faster under S.B.5 because you have the mind for it.

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  18. SB 5 will destroy public service as we know it. What individual will enter the teaching profession at 19,000 per year after spending four times that over a four year period attending college? Then you will have to subtract taxes, pension contribution which will double (yes we do currently contribute), health care costs will triple (yes we currently do pay a portion of our salary for health care). I talked to a banker today and he said that bankers have read over portions of this bill and they will no longer be giving out loans to many of these individuals being affected by SB 5 because it will be too risky and they will not be making very much money. Many of these individuals will have to spend significantly less money which will affect local businesses. Teachers will have to kiss the ass of any individual who they work for because of the lack of protection from their new contract. Who will be left to question anything that goes on in school buildings? Merit pay will motivate teachers? I’ve been teaching for 27 years and that is a bunch of bull. Eliminate pay steps? Do you really think that a first year teacher can do as good of job as someone who has been teaching for 20 years? What a joke. The reason we are in this mess is because so many jobs have been sent over seas. This started heavily in the early 1980’s and now it has finally caught up to us. Virtually everything that I purchase is made in America. It takes time and sometimes you have to use the internet but it can be done. The Gov should have been more proactive by approaching the various professions by telling them that we have to make cuts and get input from them like some of the other states did which has had positive resulys. Not only can you cut waste but individuals are responsive to pay freezes, contributing more, etc…….. We have done that. Over my 27 year career we have had three years of 0% increase and four years of 1% increase. Oh well,…………….

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    1. 19K is extreme, but I do hope that it does destroy public service as we know it, because how it is, is very broken. It is probably fine for you, and many of the people you know, but it’s not fine for most community budgets.

      It will be the parents jobs to question what goes on in the school buildings. What’s been happening is parents are shoving that responsibility off onto teachers, because it’s easy to do. I could go on and on, but you made some great comments and you put some work into it, which I admire.

      Unions had years to come to the public and bring things into step, but they didn’t. They just kept pushing forward taking more and more. We are not going to allow what happened in California to happen in Ohio.

      https://overmanwarrior.wordpress.com/2011/02/19/the-need-for-leadership/

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  19. Loved this article, I worked for state of Ohio for 6 1/2 years before I resigned, from Pay range 14 to 28 and the worst thing is the nepotism, lack of education that the employees have for the position they hold, and the money they make. There are people that make 50k a year there and don’t know how to do their job, don’t have the education, were not tested for it (even thought they were supposed to be). They have no respect for private sector employees and have complete access to everyone’s private info in the state.
    It seems to me that you need to be in a certain circle to get a job with the state, that only certain families can work there. My spouse was a temp for 2 years at the Div of real-estate and PUCO and never got hired she finally quit. Further more the union has done nothing, take the pc purchase program we had, that the union took from the state, the union said we won’t charge any interest. Then why did the pc’s cost almost 600.00 more than if I bought them at the store? In short it is way past time for something to be done. Put every one of them into a shit sifter and put the clean ones back to work. I am now in one of the seven income tax Free states and glad of it. Deep 6 the Union, if you’re worried about workers rights hire an attorney on your pay check not MINE!

    A few more things;
    Public employees don’t exist without the private sector, not the other way around!
    When WE THE PEOPLE don’t think your doing your job, I’ll be domed if I let your union stand in the way of the private sector giving you the boot, when you can’t do your job or you lied to get it! Don’t like it then come back to the private sector since all I am hearing is the public sector doesn’t get paid that much.
    As far as the Law enforcement, the other public union needs to quit riding their coat tails, no one is talking about the FOP.

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